There is no honest negotiation with Russia. They have proven it over and over again.

Their assumption was that world would just let them do what they want as they did with Crimea, and that previous mistake is direct reason for current situation.

> This mentality is was created the Cold War and has cause immense international damage throughout history.

This mentality is born from reality, Russia has agreed before to never even threaten Ukraines sovereignty, let alone actually invade.

Russia does not care about agreements, or treaties, or anything, all Russia cares about is what Russia wants.

> I’m no fan of the Russian federation, but they have legitimate security concerns regarding nato expansion.

Russia has legitimate security concerns regarding a defensive alliance expanding closer and closer to them?.

If thats the case maybe they should stop invading countries, Ukraines not the first, and unfortunately may not be the last.

NATO expansion is largely born closer to Russia from Russian imperialism(in the least for the last two members).

> Do we really want to go back to perpetual proxy wars with our adversaries?

Or Russia could not invade Ukraine and not openly call to end it as a country altogether?.

> NATO is an anti-soviet alliance from the Cold War era. We’ve been fighting proxy battles with the Russians for 80 years. Think about that! Why on earth would Russia trust us Americans and our “defensive” missile systems?

Because NATO, and America has never invaded Russia, even though they had the capability and will at the end of WW2.

> Imagine if Texas seceded from the union and tried to form a military alliance with China, Iran, and Russia. Ukraine was the second most powerful Soviet and the USSR collapsed only 30 years ago.

This would only be a fair comparison if the USA entirely collapsed and then, the free state of Texas, which, has international recognition from both the world and the country that succeeded the USA as being independent decided to join a military alliance.

> We need to stop excessively spreading our sphere of influence. We got problems at home. Obviously the US can’t back out now…but perhaps we should reassess our future military strategy before we do something REALLY stupid like go to war with China over Taiwan.

Or maybe it's that China shouldn't try and conquer Taiwan?. Like Russia shouldn't have tried to conquer Ukraine?. America(for once) and the EU really look like the goods guys this time around.

> A big fan of the American war machine huh?

Big fan of it when it arms a country against its imperialistic neighbour that is doing its best to try and obliterate a country off the map.

> It that was truly their goal, they could’ve carpet bombed their targets day 1.

Russia doesn't have the capability to do this or they would have, Ukraines air defense is too much for Russia to even obtain air superiority after 9 months.

> Their nuclear arsenal is enough to obliterate much more than Ukraine off the map…

If Russia actually nuked Ukraine they would likely collapse in the coming 10 years from the international communities response, nuclear weapons were never on the table.

> The million land mines in Southeast Asia and record setting drones strikes and 20 yr occupation of Afghanistan sure is awesome. Slurp up that propaganda baby!

I can recognise when multiple countries do bad things, something that people who are pro Russia appear incapable of doing.

Russias war in Ukraine is bad, Americas war in Afghanistan and Vietnam were bad.

I don’t even understand what you’re arguing for. Russia is so inherently evil that diplomacy is not an option? That’s insane.

If you can recognize that every country commits war, you should be able to understand that diplomacy is a viable option. I mean seriously take a moment to think critically here. My position is that deescalation is possible. Yours is that war should continue and diplomacy will never work.

Is that honestly the stance you wanna take?

> NATO expansion is largely born closer to Russia from Russian imperialism(in the least for the last two members).

Sure, and before that? NATO has been expanding since the USSR fell.

> Sure, and before that? NATO has been expanding since the USSR fell.

The year the USSR fell, the Russians invaded Georgia.

So conveniently, Russian imperialism has existed since practically as soon as Russia existed.

Maybe if Russia stopped invading countries that used to be in the USSR NATO would stop expanding.

But it's clear that they cannot help themselves and they clearly believe they have a right to try and conquer these counties.

The USSR fell in 1991 and the Russo-Georgia war wasn't until 2008. If you mean the South Ossetia conflict, that was an internal conflict by separatists that had some Russian assistance, much like Ukraine is getting NATO assistance. That's not what people typically mean by "invasion".

> The USSR fell in 1991 and the Russo-Georgia war wasn't until 2008. If you mean the South Ossetia conflict, that was an internal conflict by separatists that had some Russian assistance, much like Ukraine is getting NATO assistance. That's not what people typically mean by "invasion".

There certainly seems to be plenty of claims that Russia was overtly involved in conflict in south Ossetia and it was much more then just "assistance".