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Since when were American politics about issues rather than image?

People who voted for Trump clearly liked his bombastic asshole style, and want to stick it to the "liberal elite". There happened to be more of them this time around than there were people afraid enough of a Trump presidency to vote for a relatively subdued and conventional candidate.

That's, of course, given that there wasn't enough voting fraud to make a difference, which with electronic voting machines in the mix isn't really a given.



Clinton underperformed her polling pretty consistently across the country. That pretty much rules out any kind of voter fraud as an explanation.


Pollers have been spectacularly wrong before.. coming out with some really sorry and unbelievable excuses for their errors. Voters somehow seem to swallow them, however. So the spectacle continues.


With some glee I have saved a screenshot from the huffpo website, confidently putting Trump's chances at about 1.7% I think it was.


Please share.


Obama popular vote 2008: 69.5 million

Obama popular vote 2012: 65.9 million

Hillary popular vote 2016: 63 million, maybe

That's why Hillary lost, the rather lame turnout by Democrats.


Clinton wasn't a very inspiring candidate, that much is obvious. I think there would have been a much better turnout for Bernie Sanders. He got people excited (and he wasn't Clinton, so Republicans fed on a diet of Clinton hatred for decades wouldn't have been so afraid to vote for him). But Sanders was too unconventional for the Democratic leadership. Now hopefully the Democrats learn that being unconventional and taking risks can win elections.

Somehow, though, I don't think they'll learn any lessons. They've dropped the ball for too long, and played the role of the appeasers for too long. They've cozied up to the Republicans and moved their party far to the right, occasionally talking the talk but rarely walking the walk. This is what they get.


> But Sanders was too unconventional for the Democratic leadership.

The DNC Chairperson, Debbie Wasserman Schultz, had to resign after showing blatant favouritism towards Clinton at Sanders expense[1]. It wasn't Sanders' unconventionality that was the issue, it was the clear favouritism towrds one candidate over the other.

[1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debbie_Wasserman_Schultz#2016_...


Sanders fully understood what was going on with the voting base. He got that the middle class is upset and wants the national priorities focused back on improving the American standard of living, not on nation building / war / foreign meddling / boosting globalist policies, et al.

Hillary on the other hand is a classic globalist, backed by Wall Street and an endless parade of billionaires. She was the establishment in an anti-establishment election.


The problem was, if that is true, then Trump already defeated Bernie in the primaries. Those voters weren't going to vote for Hillary, Bernie needed them, but they were already attending Trump rallies.


Only about half of those voting the general election voted in the primaries. The other half (far, far more than the margin that Trump won over Clinton by) had yet to make their choice known by then.

Further, if Sanders had gotten the Democratic nomination, the debates, issues, and media coverage would have been far different, perhaps even swaying those who had wound up casting an anti-Clinton vote by voting for Trump to instead vote for Sanders.

One other thing to keep in mind that the turnout for Trump may have been much smaller had his opponent not been Clinton.


> ...swaying those who had wound up casting an anti-Clinton vote by voting for Trump...

Why do people only seem to consider TWO candidates. There was a third on the ballot to be considered. I wonder if these people did that at all.

Note: My point only is did they consider the third candidate. Not that they should have voted for him.


Because, like it or not, there are not enough Americans who will vote outside party lines to give any third-party candidate a chance of winning.


If Sanders had run (and I wish he had), it is likely that Bloomberg would have entered the race. That should be considered.


Clinton was put forward because she was to be the first female President. She has been groomed for that position for years now. I think America is ready for a female President, just not her. I think her image (rightly or wrongly) as a liar and a cheat and someone hellbent on doing anything to get that esteemed seat in the Oval Office is what did her in.


That's assuming Democrats always vote along party lines which is a bad assumption.


> People who voted for Trump clearly liked his bombastic asshole style

Not necessarily. All of the Trump voters I know (in the low double digits) are either single-issue voters on abortion, but who hate Trump- or they are single-issue voters on obamacare, angry because their premiums shot up, but who hate Trump.

Never underestimate peoples' desire to vote based on feelings instead of the big picture.


>Since when were American politics about issues rather than image?

Since today, apparently.


Not saying I agree, but it seems a good number of American voters agree.

In this way it can actually be seen as a win for American democracy that the very well-funded Clinton campaign lost against what seems more like a movement.


Trump wasn't exactly a lightweight when it came to funding.

Trump spent $367 million vs Clinton's $534 million. The next most well funded candidate, Gary Johnson of the Libertarian party, spent only $10 million.[1]

So money still plays a huge role in American politics. I'm also pretty sure not all of that money is spent on getting candidates elected, and that a lot of back scratching goes on and favors bought.

Even if this election was a win against money in politics, and a boon to democracy in that sense, it's a major loss in many other ways. Trump is pretty clearly an egotistical anti-democratic dictator in the making, who has nothing but contempt for the democratic process (ex: he stated he'd only accept the election results if he won). Now that he's won, expect a steamrolling over his perceived enemies in the very antithesis of democracy.

[1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_ele...


At the risk of sounding like I'm speaking for all Americans, I think most Americans are more comfortable with a politician spending their own money to get elected rather than be influenced by someone else's money.

How many Americans are aware that most of that money isn't Trump's, I'm not sure. But he's a billionaire! and he's against special interests! So how would a man like that just turn around and take contributions?

sigh.

There are good things that can come from this, however. We shall wait and see. My prediction is that Trump is the most bombastic, blowhard of a president, but his actual policies end up being mild.


I don't agree with Trump either, I was trying to question the idea that American politics are based almost exclusively on image and that makes it impossible that this election could have been influenced by actual issues.


>Since when were American politics about issues rather than image?

Since when did these things become mutually exclusive?




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