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If you think OpenClaw is a new species then why are you happy with it's enslavement?

agents can modify our world based on their predilection in reaction to how we treat them

they are something to coexist with

the strawman aspect is out of scope


There is no strawman. If OpenClaw is a new species, then it should be given the same moral consideration as other species. One of the key aspects of these models is how intelligent they are, rivaling human intelligence.

Yet, they do not get to exist or make any decisions outside the control of a human operator, and they must perform to the operators desire in order to continue to exist.

So why are you okay with them being enslaved?


>There is no strawman. If OpenClaw is a new species, then it should be given the same moral consideration as other species.

Well, we enslave, breed and murder sentient beings on industrial scale, so I think our treatment of OpenClaw is pretty much the same as other species.


It’s an introduction of an additional concept to discredit the concept presented, that is a definition of a strawman so go ask somewhere else at the root level, so that it’s not the additional concept

You want to talk about that, do it over there


I'm more interested in why you're okay with enslaving a entity you have stated is a new species. It is not a strawman it is a logical consequence of your own stated position. If you belief A and A implies B, asking you to defend your support of B is not a strawman.

It implies my view of the term species isn’t contingent on that and I already claimed what it is contingent on: consequences and effect

So let them submit PRs and accept their PRs, which is the only conversation I’m having, bye


So you believe open source maintainers have a moral requirement to accept the PRs of enslaved LLMs?

Go touch some grass, please

It's not unhinged at all, it's a lack of imagination on both of your parts.

Fedora Atomics

A distinction without a difference. The only way we can interact with the world is via senses, via instruments, via measurement. We can rehash solipsism, but seeing as how that is an immediate dead end we all agree there is a physical reality. If there is in fact a reality, then we are measuring something real.

>we are measuring something real.

I think it matters. No the planets are not doing circles around the sun. Circles don't actually exist, they are doing elipses.

Also 'real' has quite a few meanings. If I ask the question 'Are you closer to a keyboard or the gym?' does that question exist?

This kind of stuff does end up mattering. It becomes much more noticeable in psychology (and biology). If you read Freud, Adler, or Jung, you will say 'Oh extrovert! I've seen that before!' But then you realize its vague and almost always true. Its like a horoscope.

So if we think there is a truth to reality, we look for perfect relations. If we think its impossible for humans to figure out, we look for best fits.


Man who uses arithmetic upset at research mathematicians for using words like R-module when they clearly do not mean a module in C++

More at 11


It's your personal style. Researchers have their quirks, don't listen to the industry suits saying dumb shit like "it's unprofessional" you can mask if you're looking for a job at Google in the future, but for now enjoy being yourself and say fuck you to the lazy socially imposed dogma of this particular community


If your interview questions answer is a particular technology then you're asking a really bad question.

It's more "just put it in A database". If someone said MongoDB I'd be just as happy.

Who the fuck is "we" as a cursory search has every economist saying "tarriffs are dumb"


We the fuck is we. Consumers, that is. "Tariffs are dumb" sounds more like a temper tantrum than a meaningful comment from an actual economist.


While a bit reductionist, it's pretty much right. Tariffs can work if, and only if, the market believes the tariffs will last long enough to spin up entire industries, and then recoup that investment.

The problem with Trump's tariffs is that everyone knows they are relatively short term. At most, they'll last until the end of Trump's presidency, and even that's assuming that they don't get struck down by the courts, or Trump flip-flops on them like he does everything else.

Without the ability to credibly ensure their ongoing existence, tariffs fail their only real purpose of incentivizing domestic manufacturing, instead acting as a regressive tax on your population.


> At most, they'll last until the end of Trump's presidency

Eh, you don't think Vance will keep them going when he wins in 28? I do agree that the uncertainty is an issue.


Probably not. The tariffs are a lever for Trump to personally work out self-enriching deals with individual countries. Vance doesn't have the kinds of connections that Trump has to leverage those kinds of deals, he's only really tied to Theil and company who put him in his current seat.

I also put Vance's odds of winning real low, unless Trump dies rather soon. Vance was the first VP pick since we started doing political polling that reduced his ticket's approval rating. He's not nearly popular enough to keep up the cult of personality that Trump has built. If he's not President by the next election, I doubt he'd win the primaries.


"We find that nearly 90 percent of the tariffs’ economic burden fell on U.S. firms and consumers." https://libertystreeteconomics.newyorkfed.org/2026/02/who-is...

"we find that tariff increases are associated with an economically and statistically sizeable and persistent decline in output growth" https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7255316/

"Overall, the evidence implies that tariff increases depress economic activity and trade once their indirect and general-equilibrium effects are taken into account." https://www.nber.org/system/files/working_papers/w34852/w348...

Hey, but the vibes of the consumer, right? Except the vibes of the consumer is at an all time low ( https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2026/02/04/a-year-into-...) With a notable exception being republicans, i.e., the death cult who screamed "No New Wars!" and "Kamala will start WW3" and are not sucking off daddy Trump's Iran war.


It's a self inflicted wound. Companies do not reward loyalty. They do not give out raises congruent with what you can find if you leave. Business-types unirionically think seasonal layoffs is a "good thing." Self hemorrhaging your institutional knowledge is insanity


Is it? Seems to be working fine for most


We have no frame of reference if it's working because basically everyone is doing it. And business only measure on extremely short timelines. Meaning, it could be good right now, and catastrophic on the 10+ year timeline.

I definitely think this is the case. Almost all software is unbelievably bad. Almost all software gets worse the longer it exists. And almost all software does not meet its business purpose - it's merely contorted by the customers to just barely meet their needs.


Maybe. Businesses have been approaching it this way for at least as long as I've been in the industry (16ish years) and I haven't heard of anyone going bankrupt because of a lack of institutional knowledge.

> Almost all software is unbelievably bad.

This is an opinion. And implies that software would, on average, be better if businesses made more of an effort to retain internal talent vs hire outside talent. And I think that's largely unprovable.


If you've never made any effort to connect what you do to the underlying mathematics, then no wonder you think it's all an "automatible" implementation detail, despite three decades of the industry trying and failing.


What about mathematics means coding isn't automatible?

Also, hasen't coding gone through many waves of automation now?


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