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Open weight models are not open software. Its better than closed blackbox models sold by Sam and Mario, but Zuck supporting open weight models when he (and other big boys) hoards all the compute required to run any model, including open weight models only shows that he realized he cant beat Sam and Mario, so wants their leverage to go away.

Output of 3 or 4 2022 engineers? Its that your self assessment? Output as in number of lines of code?


Not op, but we are at 2400 total points delivered over seven years. 1000 of those in the last six months. About 2-4 devs over that period, just two the last six months.

Noone is questioning the volume of llm output. My question is whether all those points delivered improved your product and software in any meaningful way, or do you now have 20x more code that noone understands with the same quality of software product?

Yeah it did. We've signed three new customers because of one. Another large feature was an integration that landed more. We rewrote the entire front end to modern stack. Used to be a fifteen year old react and backbone bFrankenstein app.

I hope you do know that your comments are straight up being pasted to an LLM that addresses or counters those, not the junior dev. They are likely learning nothing other than how to increase their PR counts for managers to see.


This is so accurate. I am a fairly senior individual contributor and its been more than a year since I saw a good design doc or quality design discussion. Before you can even question the design, someone has generated a 50k line prototype and already made up their mind because of all the “you’re absolutely right..” and “X is exactly what you need..” from AI.


This very much. First thing built is what get approved. Even if it will generate 10x the workload down the line, because today's quality bar is very much demo level.

And then you get paged at 2am because prod is down and the support channel is more active than the team's one.


"Talk is cheap, show me the code"

A working prototype beats endless discussions over paper


Talk is cheap, that's why you do it before sinking months of man-effort into building a turd.


This. Exactly this. Most ideas are bad ideas. Now noone can stop all of them from being sent to prod for everyone to deal with.


A working prototype like that is good if the debate is “is this possible?”, the problem above is more for problems where it’s possible and we’re arguing which path to take


“Not in speed, but in quality” — unfortunately though, not a single CEO, executive, company, VC, investor or anyone with the power to make decisions cares about quality instead of speed.


I’m happy to report that I work for ones that do. Privately owned company with decades-long history, no VC, no profit maximization mindset.


I agree. Also, what does "code quality" even mean in the age of agentic dev? If the code works, and is secure, what else matters?

I do know what good code looks like, but does that even matter anymore? All I know is that now, I get to focus on endless UX polish, which is the only thing the matters.

I feel like we are living through something like the Protestant Reformation, where priests once spoke Latin, and then started to speak in plain local language. The old guard did not like this.


Also, what does "code quality" even mean in the age of agentic dev? If the code works, and is secure, what else matters?

AI pricing is mostly based on tokens consumed right now. Shouldn't that mean being able to quickly and reliably analyse existing code and to make only small local changes to implement new functionality is as valuable as ever - if not more so - if you're relying on agentic LLMs to do the grunt work?

A lot of things about writing clear specs and developing systematically and employing lots of different kinds of checks and controls to ensure quality and performance have always been true but used to get brushed under the carpet by a lot of cheap/lazy development teams. If LLMs really do accelerate everything about development - including negative behaviours like acting undesirably based on flawed or ambiguous information and doubling down on mistaken assumptions - then the pattern across all of these areas is that doing things the right way is more important than ever if you want to get good results from AI assistance.


> If the code works, and is secure, what else matters?

Maybe so, but it doesn't.


Seriously? 99% of the ads are trying to sell stuff you dont need at all. But they want to sell that to you. Why would you rely on an ad to realize what you NEED and then buy it?


People don’t only buy what they NEED?


Inglorious empire is another good one by Tharoor. Provides letters and statements from British officials and officers to show the intent and exploits.


Yes, Genghis was a brutal conqueror so he was a monster (rightfully). But Alexander, who was also a brutal conqueror, killed millions and literally burnt down persian capital is “the great”. See how subtle propaganda works? You dont even realize how it gets to you.


The temples built were by hindu empires like the vijayanagara empire or the marathas later who ruled significant parts of India coinciding with the turkic invasion and occupation that you are conveniently not taught in schools. The trukuc invasion left behind a trail of destroyed temples and coties. From sun temple of multan to martand temple in kashmir to ayodhya to mathura to kashi to hampi to belur and halebidu.. its literally a trail of ruins left behind. I dont even know why you are trying to argue that turkic occupation of India was somehow good for natives. The lack of pioneering art, science, technology, philosophy, astronomy, mathematics and literature during this period shows that ordinary people were just trying to survive and could not produce any of these works. Almost all of those great works were before 1000 ad.


And no, hindu and muslim conquests were NOT alike. Krishnadevaraya defeated kalinga. Instead of destroying konark sun temple, he came back and built a similar stone chariot in hampi.

The same hampi was plundered and burnt down a century later by islamic foreign invaders.

The marathas defeated mughal empire, but you dont see delhi, fatehpur sikri etc in ruins.

Hindu conquests were like regime or government change for ordinary people. At best some changes in taxation. Islamic conquest meant their cities burnt down, institutions destroyed and life destroyed.

These are not my hallucinations, the turkic invaders proudly wrote about this themselves.


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