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They have given us fuck all for raises during a period of rampant inflation and now they want to take away the one good thing that covid-19 did for workers.


I'm not sure if you got the memo, but you need to jump jobs if you want more money. This goes triple if you're not a top 5% worker.

BLS has been tracking this number and it has skyrocketed in the last generation (Number of Jobs Held in a Lifetime): https://www.bls.gov/nls/questions-and-answers.htm


I must be missing something.

https://www.bls.gov/news.release/pdf/nlsoy.pdf ("young baby boomers" age 18-56, years 1978-2020)

https://www.bls.gov/news.release/pdf/nlsyth.pdf ("older millenials" age 18-36, years 1998-2021)

The "Chart 1" in both of those seems to be almost the same logarithm and the 18-56 "baby boomer" chart at age 36 appears to be roughly the same number of jobs. It might even be slightly higher in the baby boomer chart at age 36.


A period of rampant corporate profits


Never forget this - if this were "real" inflation and not corporate fuckery then their profits would be down.


In a real inflation, why would profits be down? If the company has any pricing power, they just increase the price. In fact, the definition of inflation is prices increases.


If it is just corporate profits the state and county sure piled on by increasing my property taxes 40% over the past 3 years. That's an extra $300 a month for me which is more than my car payment.

edit: changed country to county


Did the value of your property also increase over that time period?


So the assessor says. But what does that have to do with how much tax reveneue the local government needs to operate?


yeah, almost entirely due to inflation, it isn't like I improved my home.


Median incomes have outpaced inflation over the last several years.

https://www.axios.com/2024/02/05/wages-outpacing-inflation


And at the same time people struggle to pay rent. Official inflation numbers doesn't correlate how 'median' earner spends its salary.


The rent-strugglers have the loudest voices... (and they're not "wrong" just skewing the media)


lies, damn lies, and statistics.

It's an oft-mentioned point in the last few yearss to focus on raw income and not on spending power. if you get 50% more pay but rent doubles, the vast majority of people would have less spending power. same with job numbers. "Unemployment is historically low!". meanwhile, gig and part time worked soard while full time jobs dipped.

In addition, you look further and realize how people who "gave up" after 2-3 months without an interview are not counted as "unemployed" and you realize there's a lot to break down, that no one is breaking down


Indeed it's complicated, but BLS does count them as "discouraged":

https://www.bls.gov/charts/employment-situation/persons-not-...

https://www.bls.gov/cps/lfcharacteristics.htm#discouraged

BLS may not be perfect but they're not idiots and it's wildly better than other countries.


Does the median earner when considering the entire country struggle to pay rent? Or is it just the median earner in certain extremely expensive metro areas that happen to get a lot of focus in the media because that's where the journalists live?

The numbers OP cites can be 100% accurate and reflective of reality while it is still also true that people in the Bay Area struggle to pay for housing.


There is every chance that income is a multi-modal distribution, and thus one should not talk of a single median.

However, the person to whom I was replying used cheap and not-so-cheerful language to suggest that it was possible to talk about this en masse. Assuming that to be reasonable, I replied with an en masse response.

Certainly if you break it down at the county level, I expect you'd find multiple different patterns, and would then be faced with which ones to call "typical" or "indicative".


Housing costs are not included in measures of inflation.

While they have gone up (almost certainly faster than inflation), they are not part of the inflation numbers that we hear in the news.


> Housing costs are not included in measures of inflation

Yes, they are [1][2].

[1] https://www.bea.gov/sites/default/files/methodologies/RIPfac...

[2] https://www.brookings.edu/articles/how-does-the-consumer-pri...


My apologies, home ownership costs are not included in inflation measures. But I was wrong and you're correct: rents are.

Which actually makes my point even more clearly: yes, there are a lot of anecdotes about not being able to make the rent, but these are not supported by the statistics for inflation and median income. Doesn't mean that they are wrong, but makes it more likely that there are other reasons for the proliferation of these stories.


> home ownership costs are not included in inflation measures

They are, as one of the inputs to imputed rent for owner-occupied housing.

> lot of anecdotes about not being able to make the rent

A lot is explained by regional variation. For example, real mean wages in San Francisco are back where they were in 2017 [1].

[1] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MWACL06075


>A lot is explained by regional variation.

but no one is digging in to talk about the regional variation. SF going back to being "still one of the highest CoL post genrification" instead of "unbearable for all but the elite" isn't exactly comforting.


I don't love the game of "someone posted a random article with some numbers that they found from a 5 minute Google search, but now I have to do the much harder & longer work of verifying if it's legitimate or misleading"


Since HN doesn't allow pasting images into comments (good!), I did not paste the numerous charts from the St. Louis Fed and others that I have bookmarked to show this data in various different ways. Also, the FRED numbers only go to 2022 in their data plotter, which is a problem if you want newer data (it exists).

What would prefer me to do? Post a dozen links that all the same thing, arguably less obviously?

I have not seen a single one yet that shows a decline in real wages.


No, wages have been falling since 2021 when accounting for inflation.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/inflation-has-outpaced-wage-gro...

Maybe this isn't that Axios journalist's field, but that huge spike of 9.1% annual inflation in 2022 won't be made up for by a 1% difference in 2024. Showing only the current rate and not the cumulative effects seems disingenuous.


> Maybe that Axios journalist isn't the smartest

You're both right. Real wages are down from the pandemic, but that's because they spiked massively due to the stimulus spending [1]. Real wages today are where they were in Q1 2020, which was the highest they had been since at least 1982.

Both the Axios and Journal charts are confusing because they're taking the first derivative of a complex curve.

[1] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LES1252881600Q


Thanks for posting that graph. When I went to FRED to get it, i only got a data series to 2022. I consider this be the most definitive measure that I've seen yet.


Tangent:

How do you navigate Fred effectively? I can usually find something close to what I want, but not exact through Google searches of the site.


> How do you navigate Fred effectively?

Kagi :P. I know the names of most of these data series, so it’s searching e.g. real weekly earnings fed fred.


thanks!


I don't think you understand what a meritocracy is.


> Seems like a nice sign-in option for iPhone owners but it's a portability disaster.

So basically it's like everything that Apple makes


It probably doesn't matter too much, but this is a lossy conversion. For example "Fred McIntosh" -> "MCINTOSH Fred". So the capitalization of the "I" is lost.


16 -> 32 GB of ram is a $400 option... ouch


Apple is so in love with walled gardens. I can't imagine them ever making truly open hardware. Perhaps they are uniquely qualified to make something open because of the amount of effort they have put into making things that are closed.


It's not that they love walled gardens, it's that they have different priorities than other companies. Users and usability are their primary concerns. Everything else is done to support that.

They have open-source initiatives, they like to be open like that when it doesn't interfere with those mandates. It's just that usability is such a huge thing that it impacts every step of their process.


Maybe something targeting schools/education?


A $10K lottery is a horrible idea. Most people know that on average you will lose money by buying lottery tickets. What makes it worth playing (for some people) is the (very small) chance of winning fuck you money. If I win $10k, I would be excited and happy about it, but it's going to have very little long-term effect on my lifestyle.


People play 4-digit and 3-digit as well as the scratch offs that win $10k and smaller prizes


I won't say that I thought about the numbers too much, so I'd agree that it's a "horrible" idea, however I want to point out a few things:

> Most people know that on average you will lose money

I don't think most people know this. Perhaps you do. Perhaps most of us here on HN know, but I strongly doubt most people who play do, given that most people who play are poor [1].

> What makes it worth playing...

This isn't true either. Most people who play play it for the smaller winners [1].

Finally, I just want to reiterate that the point of this is exactly what you mentioned. By making the amount small enough such that it wouldn't have a huge effect on your lifestyle, you make it safer to disclose who won.

[1] https://www.vox.com/identities/2016/1/13/10763268/lottery-po...


I suspect that many of the people who play the lottery don't view money as having a strictly linear value. Spending a dollar a day on lottery tickets is a cost that is easy to absorb (think of how many people think nothing of buying a cup of coffee from Starbucks every day). Winning the lottery means getting a relatively large infusion of cash at once, at that infusion has a higher value to power people than the loss of a small amount of money.

Put another way, as a one-time deal, would you consider spending $1 for a 1-in-a-million chance to win $100,000? For many people, that isn't a totally unreasonable bargain. But if I ask you that 10,000 times, the cost becomes spending $10,000 for a 1-in-100 chance to win $100,000. That's the real problem with the predatory nature of the lottery.


> I don't think most people know this.

You don't think most people know they're gambling when they buy a lottery ticket?


I grew up around some businesses that sold various lottery products. I'm not trying to sound mean or dismissive at all when I say this, just strictly matter of fact: I talked to a large and incredible variety of idiots and uneducated people that bought lottery tickets, whether scratch-offs or traditional Powerball type. They all universally knew the odds were bad. Universally.

They also figured that for a few dollars - which most of them could easily afford here and there - those were the best odds they were ever going to have.


I concur with this, and also add that the smaller winnings accrued along the way adds to their sense of validation.

They spend $1000 on tickets, and the day where their next $5 ends up winning them $100 on a scratch-off makes it all worth it.


You don't think that the people who play the lottery every day but only win an occasional $20 or so realize they're losing money?

Most lottery ticket buyers may be low income, but that doesn't mean they're stupid.


It still looks volatile even on a log chart!


    1. Use a freezer to make a tray of ice cubes
    2. Use a kettle to boil water
    3. Pour the boiling water over the ice and enjoy lukewarm water that required an excess of power to create.


Or maybe just that people are confident that they will find a bigger sucker to sell to.


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